Yu Hua dialogue Luo Xiang: Internal consumption of mental mental is not a bad thing. It can hone the ability of writing and love

Author:Literary vision Time:2022.09.26

Recently, Yu Hua's novel "Brothers" won the Best Foreign Language Award of Russia's Asiana Polya Literature Award in 2022. This is one of the most prestigious literature awards in Russia today. Naming the estate. Yu Hua became the first Chinese writer to win this award after Pamuk and Oz.

At the same time, Yu Hua and Luo Xiang, the two "mutual" netizens, gathered in the Pageone bookstore in Beijing Hutong and conducted a smooth conversation on the terrace of autumn wind. "Brothers" is a civilian epic that spans forty years, reflecting every ordinary person in the waves of the times. Talking about the scene, Yu Hua of the "60s", Luo Xiang of the "post -70s", and the host- "post -90s" B station UP owner "I am Yellow Duck Brother", the three generations who also span 40 years around "Brothers", which is a novel that is all -encompassing, starts literature and law, and then goes to the intersection of philosophy.

Luo Xiang: Reading "Brothers" in the early morning, I can't sleep after reading

My brother Huang Duck: This work written 16 years ago is actually an adult. At an adult age, do you have any feelings to get the Literature Award?

Yu Hua: A little unexpected. Russia's Asiana Polyana's award is a work award, not a writer award. The general significance of the work award was issued to the previous year. It was also awarded to Russian works published in 1968, and then set up awards for foreign works in 2015. This was not available before 2015. I have been to Asiana, a manor born and living for a lifetime. There are three large houses, there are three large houses, there are large forests. If we walk around in the woods, there is no problem spending two hours. The quietesty in the woods is Tolstoy's cemetery. That is the most shocking cemetery I have ever seen. There is no tombstone and no epitaphs. Stey's tomb, which is very similar to Tolstoy, his life is very simple, but it is shocking.

My brother Huang Duck: When did Mr. Luo Xiang read "Brothers" for the first time?

Luo Xiang: It should be just a short time when I just joined the job. I graduated from 2005 to teach in school. It should be that time period.

I am Yellow Duck Brother: What do you feel?

Luo Xiang: Teacher Yu Hua's book has a characteristic. When you read it, you have to read it in one breath. If you don't want to stop, you will not sleep well at night. Because you finish reading in one breath, you must be at 3 or four in the morning. After reading it, you can't sleep at night. I feel very heavy. I feel that there are stones in the chest, which is very, very heavy. But this heavy feeling itself makes people think. You will reflect on whether you will do this in similar scenes. Therefore, I think interesting works may give us a sense of feeling.

My brother Huang Duck: You say "Brothers" describes the situation of people, and unconsciously brought into some people's situation. Are there any specific situations that make you reflect on?

Luo Xiang: At that time, I read this book recently, and I had three very intuitive feelings.

The first feeling, this is a real absurd. Because it is the upper and lower parts. First of all, I personally born at the end of the upper work. I was born in the late 1970s. At that time, the upper work was over. I was wondering if I would release the darkness in my heart. I hope that there is a power that can lock the darkness of the heart, but this book promotes your reflection, because this absurdity is real. So I was thinking that we often need a role model. There is not much role model, but a role model may be like a light in the dark, at least encouraging some people to move towards slightly light.

Second, nothingness makes people indulge. Because despair can make people nothing, this kind of nothingness will make us don't know why, why die, we live a daily life. Therefore, this kind of life may use blindly to confront the world, just like there is a character in it, traveling around the world every day.

Third, in the era of material desires written by Teacher Yu Hua, many people have money, like Li Lightou, but may have a reminder to me. Maybe real happiness is a kind of calm. Recognize ourselves, know who we are, where we come from. Li Liangtou finally wanted to take a spacecraft to go to heaven, but will there be peace in his heart? Looking at this earth, do you have peace when you look at this moon? I don't know, but he really wants to go to heaven. But the real battlefield of life may still be in our hearts, because the calmness of the heart is a very big happiness, just like Plato said, human rationality, passion, and desire. These three things are always fighting. Whatever we work hard to ensure a balance, ensure a harmony, and maintain a middle way. Maybe this reminder to my personal person is the greatest happiness.

I am probably three intuitive feelings: real absurdity, nothingness, indulgence, and calmness is a kind of happiness.

Yu Hua: Writing is mental internal consumption. I have been consumption for 40 years

My brother Huang Duck: Now there is a word on the Internet that is very hot, called "mental internal consumption". I don't know if Teacher Luo Xiang and Teacher Yu Hua have heard of this word.

Yu Hua: I heard.

I am Huang Duck: I think internal consumption is a feeling of young people now, that is, special look forwards, thinking about it, but I ca n’t put it into action. I feel that the internal consumption has some connections with the absurdity. In Kafka's works, it seems that some protagonists face a very absurd reality and then enter a state of mental internal consumption. I would like to ask the two, have you experienced a strong mental internal consumption before life?

Yu Hua: This mental internal consumption is very similar to the process of writing of writers. The writing process is that when we did not find a good exit, writing was looking for exports. How to write, I feel like this is so good for a while, and I feel that this is not good for a while. When I find the exit, everything is gone, and the mental internal consumption is over. Internal consumption may be a kind of negative, and people seem to be able to live with themselves, but in fact it is also a positive emotion. Why? If he is not good, he doesn't consume internal consumption. To a certain degree of mental consumption is to find an exit, find the exit of his own life, or simply speaking, looking for my exit today, or looking for the exit of my awakening tomorrow, everything must be seen from two aspects. This is my understanding.

I am Yellow Duck Brother: As a writer, you seem to put in the contradictions, let these two contradictions fight in it, and finally turn it into a work with the exit.

Yu Hua: Yes, when I taught my students, I told them that if you encounter difficulties when writing, it means that you are progressing. Writing if you are smooth, you may walk in place. Only when you encounter difficulties can you move forward. It is impossible to go forward without encountering difficulties. Difficulties often cause people's mental internal consumption. From a positive perspective, we are not talking about mental internal consumption. From an individual, it is not necessary to turn it into a generalized social phenomenon. Internal consumption is actually to want to do better, and this situation has internal consumption.

I am Huang Duck: I can hear, you are already a "internal consumer".

Yu Hua: Writing is an internal consumption. I have written for 40 years and the internal consumption for 40 years.

I am Yellow Duck Brother: Students who are in the mental consumption, don't feel too hit.

Yu Hua: Don't worry, it will come out.

My brother Huang Duck: Teacher Yu Hua consumes 40 years in 40 years.

Yu Hua: My internal consumption is internal consumption. This 40 -year consumption is not once, which is composed of countless internal consumption.

Luo Xiang: We need to make love thick and practical

I am Huang Duck: I want to ask everyone a question. Comparing with human nature is love. In the story, in fact, it seems to be more missing, mainly in Li Liangtou. Li Langtou wants to be with Lin Hong very much, but the more he wants to pursue Lin Hong, the farther Lin Hong is from him. So it seems that love is a natural ability. If you do not have this ability, you will not get love. I think this is a question that contemporary young people are very concerned. How do we find love? Should we make ourselves worthy of love?

Luo Xiang: I personally think that people always like to think about issues, but the limited nature of human beings reminds us that we may find the middle way in the paradox. This is the problem you raised. Love is the ability of innate or acquired? We can't choose the side station, there may be all. First of all, love must be innate, why should we love? Because we lack. Why do people always want to love and be loved? Because people are lacking, people are lonely, and people want others to love themselves. When you want others to love, you admit that you are not satisfied with your congenital innateness. At the same time, love must have acquired learning, although not to say that this kind of learning is skill, because the teachings of all ancient sages of humans, the teaching of all the great classics of human beings, including the Dharvyevsky mentioned by Teacher Yu Hua , Tolstoy, they constantly remind us that a great problem is that people do not know how to love, people's love always causes themselves and others, because people are so narcissistic, all your love It may be just a narcissistic projection, and the more narcissistic projection, the more love, the more hurt. These great classics remind us that love needs the acquired learning. This acquired learning is to constantly admit our limited nature and continue to change from narcissistic love to non -narcissistic love, because love is that we want to become perfect.

I am Huang Duck: So it seems to be a more complete through others.

Luo Xiang: I personally is very contradictory. The real love is to hope that I will become perfect, I hope that others will be perfect. I hope that two people can be able to sacrifice each other, sacrifice each other, and improve each other. Two imperfect people are combined together to become more perfect. In such a process, it is definitely not a kind of self -centered. It is to sacrifice each other, achieve each other, improve each other, improve each other, embrace each other, and then move towards deeper and farther satisfaction.

I am Yellow Duck Brother: It seems that love is a kind of narcissism we need to let go of myself. Instead, I can present myself in this process and make myself more complete. It is actually a kind of cocoon self -restraint.

Luo Xiang: We need a traction of responsibilities, make our love thick, make our love be solidly, and make our love a completeness to others and the completeness of ourselves. We have become better, what do we love ourselves? In this process, many corners are sacrificed, many preferences are also sacrificed, and many prejudices need to be adjusted. I am Yellow Duck Brother: Love makes us better. Does Teacher Yu Hua want to share?

Yu Hua: Let me add a little bit. Tothaervsky had a marriage before. He actually had a lot of bad habits, especially gambling. Once he returned to St. Petersburg to lose money, so his wife left him. He later found a shortcoming person named Anna and married. Anna did bring a lot of help to Dha Ervsky. In such a short time, from "Sin and Punishment" to "Sin and Punishment" to "Sin and Punishment" "Karamazov Brother" wrote a lot of works. He died at the age of 59, and Tolstoy lived to 82 years old. The number of two people's works, instead, was a little more. Looking at Torstai again when they fell in love with Sophia, Sophia was 18 years old, Tolstoy was 34 or 35 years old. His "Childhood", "Youth" and "Youth" have been published. In Sofia, Tolstoy, Tolstoy also loves Sophia. Love is often a possession. When Sofia and Tolsta have possess each other, they have started torture for their lifetime. When I went to Tolstea Manor, the commentator said that when Tolstoy left home, what book was opened on the bedside table? Kiki, Tolstoy knows how remarkable it is.

He also envied Dharvsky a Anna. But we need to know that Sophia gave birth to Thirteen children to Tolstoy, and a woman's 13 children were very hard. She copied the manuscript seven times for "War and Peace". After Tolstoy wrote all the sleep every day, Sophia copied all the content he wrote today. Essence He was still modified until "War and Peace", and the printing plant had to let him add money. There are 2 million words in this book. In this way, Tolstoy is still dissatisfied, or I still feel that Sophia is not good. Why? After love becomes possessive, it often becomes torture, and they really torture each other for a lifetime. Because their values cannot be completely consistent, Tolstoy will not compromise, and Sophia will not compromise. Two people who do not compromise are loved each other. The way of torture spent their lives.